Heidi Solomon-Orlick 0:00
Businesses grow and thrive and, and make money. I might as well do it for my own business and and my husband’s business, you know? So yeah, after 33 years, I’m following my dreams.

Anne Bibb 0:14
Welcome to Unexpected Journey, the show where each week top professionals share work wisdom and life lessons about their careers and what they have learned about human experience in the workplace. I’m your host, Anne Bibb Heidi Solomon-Orlick is an award winning BPO industry veteran with over 30 years of global sales and executive leadership experience. Heidi is Chief growth officer for the doors group, and founder and CEO of girls who sell LLC, an organization that is committed to democratizing professional sales, and building the largest pipeline of diverse early stage female sales talent. She is also the host of the girls who sells spotlight podcast, a two time author who recently released the book heals to deals, how women are dominating in business to business sales, and is a two time gold Stevie Award winner for Women of the Year in sales.

Before we begin, don’t forget to subscribe, and leave your comments below. Now, let’s get started. Hello, everyone, and welcome back, not just to you, but to our very first repeat guest. Heidi,

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 1:36
thank you so much. And I appreciate you having me back.

Anne Bibb 1:40
I’m excited, I’m excited for a couple of reasons. Because one, always love talking to you. But you are the epitome of what we are about. And that is taking the unexpected journey and seeing where it’s going to go. And a lot has happened to you since your last time here.

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 2:01
Yeah, absolutely. You know, as we were saying career paths are definitely not linear, linear and, and sometimes unexpected things have happened and you just have to go with the flow.

Anne Bibb 2:13
Ya know, going with the flow is a little scary. Sometimes it can be, it can be and you have had a 30 plus year career. In corporate in the corporate world,

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 2:34
that’s right. Actually more if you consider 10 years in the advertising agency business, so pretty much for decades, but you know, 333 years in business process outsourcing.

Anne Bibb 2:52
And recently, you made a change and pivoted away from corporate.

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 2:59
I did so, you know made the decision to exit out of corporate, I’ll tell you at 64 If you had told me that I was going to be transitioning into full time entrepreneurship, I probably would have told you you had lost your mind. But but here we are, and it’s what we’re doing. So I’m going to double down and really focus on expanding and growing GirlzWhoSell which is obviously been something I’ve been doing over the last three years as a side hustle and passion project and made the decision to make it my full time gig. But I’m also going to be supporting my husband, as his Chief Growth Officer. He owns a local real estate company called the DORS group which is powered by Keller Williams and, and you know, I made the decision that if I’m going to be spending my days helping businesses grow and thrive and and make money I might as well do it for my own business and and my husband’s business, you know, so yeah, after 33 years, I’m following my dreams.

Anne Bibb 4:11
You know, it’s interesting to me, though, because I hear a lot of people these days talk about making that change making that pivot to start working for themselves and start the entrepreneur journey. I’m one of many you’re now one of many.

What was it? There’s a lot of thought that goes into that decision. What was that one thing that really pushed you over and said, You know what, I’m ready. I’m ready to take that leap.

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 4:48
Well, I’d like to say that I didn’t have a push but I did have a bit of a push. So my position at the company I was working for In addition to 65 others was eliminated. These days, it is a lot of companies are downsizing or right sizing depending on how you want to think about it. And so I was really faced with a decision of whether I wanted to continue what I would what I was, and had been successfully doing over the past, you know, three decades, you know, going and working for another BPO company, they’re in executive leadership, or sales leadership role, or an individual contributor role, or make make a change. And, you know, girls who sell is something that I have been really passionate about, when, after my parents passed, and we had talked about this on your last show, I spent a lot of time thinking about legacy and impact and, and what I could do to leverage my, you know, expertise and professional sales and combine that with my passion for, for working with, with young young women and, and girls who sell was born as a way to democratize professional sales and, and help solve for the pipeline gap. And, you know, it’s something that I’ve been doing successfully, and I’m proud of what we’ve accomplished over the last three years, but really wanted to take the business to the, to the next to the next level. And, you know, I’ll tell you, I’ve had major swings, you know, thinking about going from, you know, totally elated and excited, and yeah, got this to absolute terror and fear and thinking, you know, have you lost your mind, you know, you’re walking away from a salary and a 401k and benefits and, and something that, you know, you’ve been comfortable doing for so many years. And, you know, I had a lot of conversations about, you know, with, with trusted advisors and friends and sort of my personal board of directors that said, Listen, you know, what, you have nothing else to prove in the BPO world, you’ve spiked the ball, you’ve closed over a billion dollars in business over your, your three decade career, you’ve created 1000s of jobs around the world, you’ve worked with some of the most prestigious brands for some great BPO companies. So you know, what more? What more do you have to prove? You know, you know, and I was seeking cash. That’s true, I don’t have anything to prove to anybody but myself. And so as thinking about my next step, it was like, I really started to have a lot of conversations around, if not now, when I’m 64 years old, if I don’t do it now, when, and if not me who? So that was the big, the big aha moment. For me that just said, You know what, just go for it.

Anne Bibb 8:07
You said something just now that I hope everybody really heard. And it’s so important, and not just when you’re going out on your own. But when you’re going up for a new job, when you’re trying to make decisions about your future, when you’re just considering real big life and career changes. You consulted with your trusted advisors, and your personal board of directors. And I, I want to hit this pretty hard, because I know many people across many different industries who have these individual trusted advisors and personal board of directors. So when you said that talk to talk to our guests talk to our listeners about what did you mean? Because those are really two different things. Yeah, yeah. So who are not necessarily who like you don’t have to give your secrets away on who those are. But how did you come across your trusted advisors? How did you develop your personal board of directors and how, like, what does this involve in your life? How do you figure out who to go to about what?

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 9:27
Yeah, so there they are two different things. And so we’ll start with the personal side of it. And of course, that tends to be you know, close friends and family that know that and have your who know you, right, and know what makes you tick, and are individuals that are going to call out your bullshit that are going to be honest and transparent. And, and have an absolutely authentic conversation about what they feel is best for for you for me, right? So it’s individuals that you know that, you know, when you talk to them, and you go to them and you ask them, you know, listen, are you tell them this is what I’m thinking about? Could you give me some input? But do you think they’re gonna, they’re gonna tell you like it is. And those are the people, you know, and I don’t want to surround myself with people that are just Yes, men or Yes, women, or, or whatever, I want to surround myself with people that are going to challenge me on a personal level, because that makes me better. And it makes me it gives me the ability to really be able to step back and take a look at myself from a different a different lens. So that’s my personal board of directors, people that are going to hold me accountable, that they’re going to be honest and truthful about what they feel is the best thing and it’s not about them. It’s actually literally about, you know, this is what I believe is the best thing for you.

Anne Bibb 11:09
So when you are weighing all of these things, talking to your advisors, talking to your board of directors, what were the things that they said? Let’s get these in order? What were the kind of questions that they asked to kind of check you and make sure you were ready or be the ad, you know, the cross check advocate for you? What did they recommend you have in line before you made the jump?

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 11:40
Well, definitely finances was was something that was brought up consistently that you need to feel confident that that your that your finances are in order, what does that look like how much time are you’re going to give yourself to be be successful and really make a go as is three months is six months is it two years, whatever it is, and, and only I and my husband, my family really know our financial situation. But we needed to really take a look at that, and needed to get buy in from my husband and my family about making this kind of major shift and major, major decision because it doesn’t just impact impact me, it impacts my entire family making this kind of decision. So that was that was the first checkpoint. And then it was really taking a look at you know what, what’s important to you. At this stage in your life, when you think about what you want to accomplish in the next year, three years, or five years, or 10 years of your life or however, you know, whatever that timeframe is, what does that look like? And all of them encourage me to really journal and to do some, you know, self exploration as to what is really important. And, and then thinking about, you know, if I’m feeling fear, what what is it that is? is causing that that fear? Is it is it because I’m afraid that I won’t be successful? Is it? Because I’m afraid that I’m going to lose the perceived security of a of a corporate job? You Is it? Yeah, I mean, there’s a lot of things that it could be, what was interesting for me is that the fear for me was losing my identity, because I am becoming irrelevant, because so much of who I am has been tied to my corporate position, that making the decision to exit out of corporate, I had to really think through. Okay, so who am I now? And what does reinvention look like? And how do I redefine myself and start to begin to really to recognize that I am not my job. I’m not my title. I’m not how much money I make. I am much more than that. And so that was a big part of beginning to think, think through that. And then another big part of the fear for me and maybe some of our listeners or your listeners can really get this is not only of okay, now now what am I write, but how do I fill that empty, empty space? And so I’ve been working with a spiritual advisor and business consultants since the time my position was eliminated, and I and because, and she’s part of my advisory team, right? saying, you know, gosh, Mike, my inclination, one is to either okay, I’m just gonna go and get a new job, or oh my gosh, I have all this time right now that was being filled up by all the work that I had to do for the companies that I was working for, what how do I fill all this empty space. And what she advised me which was has been really hard, but really brilliant, is that sometimes you just need to sit in the silence. Because if you if you are okay, in sitting in the silence, and resisting your inclination to fill that empty space, you can hear what the universe is trying to guide you to do.

Anne Bibb 15:58
I know a lot of individuals that one work is their identity. And when they lose a job, they go into a spiral

of deep depression. Oh,

absolutely. And to those same individuals, or maybe even some that are like right outside the cusp, if their calendar is not jam packed with stuff. They don’t feel like they are being productive. They feel like they are, you know, leaving something on the table. And I mean, like, back to back, and not just even in work like in their regular life, you look at their weekend schedule, and you’re like, how, how they’re going from one to another to another, there’s no sitting in silence? Ever. It’s constant physically,

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 16:54
yeah, I just read an article, and they call it work addiction. But I think it’s so much more than just work right? Like I do, I do believe that we are conditioned to, you know, feel that if we’re busy all the time, and and that we’re productive, then we’re done, then we’re worth something that there’s, you know, that we can place some kind of value on that. And that, you know, if we’re just sitting and reading a book, or Oh, my goodness, that’s not, you know, that’s not productive, right? And I do I do, you know, I’ll call myself the, you know, call it a spade, right? Like, I, I do believe that I have been addicted to that level of productivity. And so it’s super scary to, to think about as a part of my reinvention process of carving out more time for self care and for myself, and to do the things that are important, just because not necessarily that they’re that it’s going to move the needle in anything, it’s just just because I want to, or, you know, it’s something that’s important for me at the time. So I think, I think, you know, people really do need to evaluate and assess that. And take take a look at it. And this is no judgement zone. Listen, I am as guilty as anybody of filling my time. What’s also been interesting, though, that even that, since my announcement about transferring out of corporate, I probably like you and everyone else listening. I’ve had so many people reach out to me, Oh, well, I’d love to partner and let’s have a coffee chat. And I don’t even know I’m uh, I get, you know, 100 messages, messages today, a day of people doing that, and what, what’s been interesting in this, okay, you know, should I just fill up all this empty space is I could sit for 810 hours a day, and beyond coffee chats, and not do and feel really productive, but not do anything to move the needle in my business. So one of the things that I’m really trying to get better at is to be more protective of my time, and really think about, you know, listen, I love mentoring women. I love just doing coffee chats, but I can’t do it 810 hours a day, and still run her business and help my husband grow his business. So maybe I carve out, you know, two hours a week or three hours a week that that is going to be my time that I’m going to fill in. I’m going to do coffee chats and I’m going to mentor people and I’m just going to talk to people just because but but then and everything else, I need to be very much more protective of my time. Because I need to focus on the things that are going to help. You know, help me meet my objectives and why I did this in the first place.

Anne Bibb 20:15
Protecting Your time is one of the most difficult, difficult lessons to learn as you move up in any role, because you want to be there to help you want to be there to mentor, you want to assist, you want to be available to your teams, and to really anybody else that reaches out. But if you don’t protect your time, then you are not going to be able to have the brain space to have those creative moments to be able to, to be there for your team or your family or yourself and accomplish your own goals. You have to protect your calendar, you have to protect your time.

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 20:55
And I think I completely agree 100% And especially as an entrepreneur, because when you’re in corporate, your time isn’t your own. For the most part, you know, for me, I was going from meeting to meeting to this meeting that meeting, I was you know, hosting client visits, I was doing client presentations, I was prospecting, I was doing team meetings, I was coaching my team I was doing like I was doing, gazillion different things. My time was not my own, then you’re out of corporate. And you got all this time you go to empty calendar. I remember my first day that I transition out of corporate in my first day, and my calendar was completely empty. I was like, oh my god, like, Mike, what do I do? It quickly filled up, by the way, but but I think as an entrepreneur, and in particular, you need to really think about how to predict that time because one you can never get it back. And to it, it’s finite. And

Anne Bibb 22:10
as much as we don’t want to admit that

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 22:14
it isn’t it is it just it just is and even though it feels good, it feels good. I love listen, I feels good to go on and do a mentor call or coffee chat and, and everything else. And I’m not saying that that’s not still a priority. But as a non entrepreneur now. And my I control my calendar and my time I’m really trying to carve out blocks if I do a better job of time blocking. I’m going to spend time strategizing this I’m going to just spend time being quiet this I’m going to spend this number of hours I’m going to spend time in coffee shops and and mentoring individuals. You know, I still have to prospect in my business. I mean, listen, that’s part of entrepreneurship. If you’re not generating revenue, then you don’t have a business. So I have to carve out time for that. So yeah, just trying to get better, a little bit better, better at that.

Anne Bibb 23:16
So you are not only our first repeat guest you are our first guest to come back and play this or that for a second time.

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 23:27
Oh, okay.

Anne Bibb 23:28
So this is i i think that we will I hope that we are getting different phrases this time but you know, the way the game works, you just never know. We may get the same words and we’ll see if it’s the same answers. So you remember how the how the game is played?

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 23:48
I do I don’t remember the questions. Yeah, I do. But they’re out there so people can a side by side. Person since last time we talked so you are you are my answers are different.

Anne Bibb 24:03
So first one is summer vacation or winter vacation.

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 24:12
depth in it. Lee when I like doing a winter vacation, but I do like going to someplace warm

Anne Bibb 24:25
with a winter vacation in a southern location.

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 24:31
Isn’t that dichotomy?

Anne Bibb 24:35
This is hard. Because I love the beach. I love it. Like I sleep to the sound of the ocean and it’s very relaxing. But I’m in Texas and let’s face it, the only time you see snow is when the whole state shuts down for two weeks. So I mean snow is not a good thing you You’re and I think in quite react and in reality we we really see ice more than we ever see snow. I think we’ve seen snow once a decade. So I go with winter and go to someplace that sees real snow and not the black snow. Like I want to go someplace that it’s beautiful and white because we don’t get that here. Like I can go to South Texas and go to a beach. I get summer all year long. Like I want to go someplace that I don’t get to experience. So I’m gonna go with a winter snow beautiful winter wonderland.

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 25:41
Yeah, I am not a beach person. So even when I’m going someplace warm, you’re not going to find me, you know, in a hammock.

Anne Bibb 25:51
Running and slovo like Pamela and

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 25:54
you know, like running I you know, I’m more inclined like for instance, my husband and I for in December which is real close cold here in New Hampshire, just Bill booked a trip to South America so we’re going to Rio and all through South America. So that’s my kind of, alright, I’ll do it in winter but I’ll go somewhere that a little warmer or going to Bali or going to Thailand or you know those kinds of destinations were but I have always said like when I did my community service environmental conservation project but the to Thailand and Cambodia for for three weeks. No, I’ll close to a month and I worked with the hoots and I live down in we went to remote villages in Thailand and lived with host families and then I went to Cambodia and and trained and taught English to young kids and in school. That was all done in the winter. It’s like okay, take me out of the snow and put me in someplace warm where I can actually I don’t know still do something more than I don’t know.

Anne Bibb 27:21
Oh, my God we don’t get what we what we get

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 27:24
that yeah, do something that still fills my fills my soul.

Anne Bibb 27:29
I love it. Love it. Road trip, or cruise.

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 27:35
Oh cruise. I’ve really I’ve really become a cruise on this trip. South America trip we’re going on a on a cruise. And it’s just something that I’ve really loved over the last couple of years, just because you get to see lots of different destinations in a very short period of time. And so I’ve really, I’ve really come to enjoy cruising. Now it’s a little bit of a because my husband is not only love cruises, but I have convinced him that it’s the it is a good way to go.

Anne Bibb 28:10
I used to be very much a road tripper, like I love to be a good long 10 day road trip, see the world kind of bit. Loved it. But I have transitioned over to cruising for a couple of reasons. One, I no longer have to be part of the driving team. That’s a good that’s a big, that’s a big one. too, not restricted on locations anymore. Like let’s face it when you’re on a road trip it is you know, limited, limited ways to go. And there’s just something again, the ocean sound the ocean. And there’s so many places you can see yes, sometimes it’s just one day or two days that you’re at dock. But you know what? I’m probably wouldn’t have seen that place. Had it not been for that port of call. Yeah, absolutely.

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 29:12
I agree. No, I don’t mind doing like a weekend road trip. Like we’re my husband and I love doing our weekend road road trips. We’ll go to Portland, Maine, we’ll go to Connecticut, we’ll go to Vermont, we’ll go to Montreal even it’s only four hours away. So, you know, short road trips I’m super into. But if I’m going to go for an extended period of time, I’d love that. I don’t have to think yes, cruise and then I know where I’m gonna be when I don’t have to think about it. I plan all my excursions and then it’s just an not to just

Anne Bibb 29:48
showing up and you’re like

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 29:51
and for him for those of us that have to think so much and constantly, you know, planning all of our lives is so

Anne Bibb 29:59
decisions Fatigue is right.

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 30:01
It’s so great. It’s so real. It’s so great to be on a cruise and just say you know what, just tell me where to be when and I’m, I’m good. And if I’m on the ship and just sailing that day, I hit the spa. I’ll go do napkin folding I’ll do completely brainless you know that I go play game times

Anne Bibb 30:23
I just like to go sit in that front area where you can watch and you just relax and zone out and just watch where you’re going.

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 30:33
Watch where you’re going see and so you and I I feel a cruise in our future

Anne Bibb 30:38
I do to Heidi like a girls cruise. Hey, anybody else in the women who sell oh this can be Yes I see this coming up on Heidi’s and minds but Lincoln bio soon so All right, last one. What is it going to be? It is going to be coffee shop or bakery. Oh, this one’s easy for me. But is it for you?

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 31:11
Oh no coffee shop for for sure. I you know I’ll go I can go hang out. Again. That’s another really good place for me to get out of my head. And I’ll go to a Starbucks and just sit down have a you know, a coffee and get a get a toasted blee plain bagel and just be able to sit there until and it’s a really if I if I want to get out of my office and get out of my head. A really good coffee shop is where where you’ll find me.

Anne Bibb 31:54
I am a coffee too. Now don’t get me wrong. I I love bakeries. But we’ve already had this conversation. I am a celiac and there just are I mean, I have seen lately more and more like gluten free bakeries popping up. But until I find one that is 100% gluten free, has some like equivalent yeast rolls, croissants sourdough, like good all. Like you want to pop them like you pop the Golden Corral yeast bowls. Like until you get that. Oh, in cinnamon rolls and blueberry muffins. I could just go on all day. I miss me some bread.

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 32:49
It’s gonna Hi. I’m also feeling your next stage in your entrepreneurship journey is you need to go open up a bakery. I

Anne Bibb 32:59
used to own a bakery. Did you know that way? I didn’t know that. Yes, I did. I owned a bakery. In the, in the arts. Before I was diagnosed with celiac, I made huge gigantic wedding cakes. I was not too shabby at it. But you know that was it was a it was a blip in the blip and and journey where I had stepped away to do my passion. Baking and various

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 33:34
I did not know that about you. Wow. That’s pretty cool. Yeah. Well, who knows? Maybe that’s a

Anne Bibb 33:40
that was a long, long time ago. And you know, I haven’t practiced in a very long time. And my hands are a lot shakier than they used to be.

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 33:55
But you know, I’ll find you at the coffee shop. Then

Anne Bibb 33:58
you’ll find we’ll we’ll have coffee shop. We’ll have coffee on the cruise.

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 34:03
There you go.

Anne Bibb 34:04
There we go. There we go. So talking about women who sell this is October. Yes, very special month. There are women who sell.

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 34:17
That’s right. It’s women in sales month.

Anne Bibb 34:19
And that’s kind of one of the reasons that we wanted to chat again. So what exactly it talked to me about the importance of this month for women in sales.

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 34:31
You it’s it’s an opportunity to celebrate women in the profession and to amplify and support women in in the sales profession is the way i i think about it. You know, there’s a lot of events and a lot of you know, women in sales communities come together. And what I love is that we lift each other up up. And we utilize this month as an opportunity to really talk about sales to be able to begin to debunk some of the negative perception myths about sales, create education and just support each other, and hopefully inspire young women from my, you know, from girls who sell perspective to consider a career in sales, which I think is one of the best careers in the world.

Anne Bibb 35:32
You know, it can be for sure. And I was looking up some facts about women in sales. And as of February of 2023, women make up just under 30%, of the sales industry. And most of those are filling customer service and account management role. And in when we start talking about the leader, so the leadership of the industry, only 26%, of leaders in the sales industry, are women or people who identify as women. And when I heard those numbers, I was pretty shocked. Because I know that when we start, you know, talking about equality, and we start talking about women breaking the glass ceiling or moving up in leadership, and I started hearing numbers like, you know, it’s closer to 40%. But we have to get more granular when we look at specific roles in specific industries. So I was kind of surprised to see 26% and leadership of women in sales

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 36:47
that’s higher than the numbers I’ve seen, but it’s improving, you’ll see some recent, you know, data that was just published about, you know, the increase in women and percent of women in the C suite. And you know, that the challenge that I see, particularly in sales is wells, but maybe twofold. Two is, when you look at those numbers, if you look at that 30%. Of so it’s probably 26% of the 30%, I would think because the numbers I’ve seen are about 19%. When you look at women in leadership, it’s about 19%. So it’s about it’s like 30%. Overall, when you look at women and skin sales leadership, it’s about 19%, when you look at women and tech sales have dropped to about 12. And then when you look at women of color, kind of diversity statistic, it drops into the low single, single digit. And that’s

Anne Bibb 37:56
just not acceptable at all. It’s just dismal.

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 37:59
Right. So that I actually that’s why girls yourselves board was to try to solve for that, for that, you know, issue and it’s going to take a village, it’s going to take all of us to be able to move the needle, particularly in increasing the the numbers around diverse diversity. You know, you talk about women breaking, breaking the glass, you know, ceiling, I’m not sure that that is, is as big of an issue, because women do have the motivation and desire to, you know, accelerate their careers, and to break into higher level leadership positions. What’s happening, and I saw just a recent article, I think it was in the Wall Street Journal or at Harvard Business Review, I don’t remember but it was about how it was about the broken rung. And what’s really happening is that women are not being held back by the glass ceiling per se. But there that there where where things begin to break as they’re moving from director level to BP. So it’s really in that mid level area of of career development where the biggest issue and problem and challenge happened, right. So I don’t that needs to be fixed. I really think we need to look at at that and what kind of training and career path pathing and investment are corporations making to their mid level managers so that they can continue to career path up. It’s also the time in that mid career level where a lot of women are taking career breaks So they may be exiting to take care of families. And that’s causing some challenges as they begin to enter back into the market. That their, their experience is, and the value that they can bring to the table as being diminished by corporations. And I just think that it’s like, get over it. Right. Okay. Just because a woman decided to take a career break, doesn’t mean that she’s any less valuable.

Anne Bibb 40:33
So what do you think is happening in that timeline? You know, director to VP, there’s an and that could, I mean, you specifically identified that right. But there are other areas that that’s happening, too. So yeah. Do you think that’s happening in that, that gap? Aside from potential career breaks? That could be of assistance? Or maybe, is it something that girls who sell could help with? Or what is what is?

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 41:07
Yeah, we focus on early stage, talent. So you know, our focus is really beginning to build the pipeline, and have diverse talent, position, sales is viable. And reputable, lucrative career alternatives. There’s a lot of really good organizations, like women sales, pros and Girls Club and women in sales in the National Association for Women, sales professionals, and others, that are doing some fantastic work in working with women, to help them take their careers to the next level, to give them the skills and training, to to, to career path up in sales. But I, so those are organizations are great, but I don’t my end, and I don’t have any, necessarily any data to back this, but at least not just handy to me right now. But I really do believe that companies are not doing enough to really invest in women, and to create environment and with very specific training and career path pathing so that women have a very clear idea of exactly what they need to do to be able to progress up through the organization. And and it’s a problem and so they they exit or they, you know, women exit or they go do something else, or they they transition into entrepreneurship or because they’re not. They’re not good companies are not making the investment that they need to make in their growth in order for them to be successful.

Anne Bibb 42:59
Is this generally, in your opinion, more company specific training that is needed? Or is it actually a just a sales skill that they need? That would be helpful for them to continue with that growth?

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 43:19
I think there’s probably a common combination of that. I see the sales skill training, I think the or the lack of it impacts more of the turnover at the early stage jobs. And it’s, I mean, if you look at turnover turnover in the SDR and BDM and AE level, it’s absolutely stunning. It’s, it’s, it’s horrendous. So that to me, is, you know, let me let me give you the right training, instead of coming in, we’re going to teach you the product for three days, and we’re going to throw you to the wolves or we’re going to give you a quota and expect you to meet it in six months. And if you don’t, you’re gone. So, and I’m not saying that all companies do that there are a lot of companies that are doing a good job of providing, you know, sales skills training, but I would venture to say if you look at the numbers of individuals that just you know, that are turning over at the early stages of their sales career. There they’re what’s being provided is inadequate. I’m talking about really something different though when I do believe that when you start progressing up and you get to that, you know manager level and then you get to the director level and then you start you know progressing up to the VP level. That is a different set of skills that and and training that is required. That’s more around people leadership and But yeah, more around leadership skills and how to gain consensus and conflict resolution. And then just even being able to provide to say, in order for you to get from point A, to point B to point C, these are the exact things that you need to do this the exact training that you need. This is the results that we need to see. And it’s great. It’s just great. So I think, and I don’t know, I think it’s more of a women problem. But I think it’s just a problem overall. That, right, I mean, it probably impacts women more, because there’s so much fewer women that are actually getting into those levels of positions. So from a numbers perspective, it’s it’s, you know, it’s more impactful in terms of the percentage of women that it impacts, but I think this is the broken Run Run is a is an issue overall. And companies just need to do a better job of providing that kind of training and, and career career paths so that individuals don’t get frustrated and leak and turnover. Because if you don’t, all you’re doing is spending your time filling empty buckets.

Anne Bibb 46:22
So I’m curious. You mentioned leadership management and conflict resolution. For individuals kind of moving up in the organization, when do you think is the right time for somebody that is, in the sales, they’re moving up, they know where they want to go? They know, they want to move up that chain? Right? When is the right time to start mentoring and teaching them these traits? The earlier the

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 46:55
better? That, you know, I don’t, it’s hard to say, well, when somebody gets promoted to a manager, that’s when you need to start training those skills. I think that those kinds of skills, like building confidence, and there’s so many things, right, like I just mentioned, three things, there’s, there’s a lot more, there’s

Anne Bibb 47:16
a lot more,

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 47:17
there’s a lot more training that I believe needs to happen. But I think that even if those things are integrated, as a part of your curriculum early on the earlier the better, in fact, you know, worked work training, a lot of those things in girls are cell Academy, you know, we’re teaching a dive school students and to, to, you know, college age, women, and frankly, you know, I want to get younger, I want to start teaching these kinds of skill sets, you know, at five years old, and in elementary school, and continue to reinforce them along the way. So as, as individuals, you know, as women, you know, begin to progress up into these management level positions, that isn’t as innate skill set, that then just gets reinforced in the training that’s provided, you know, within an organization as you begin moving up the career career ladder, so, you know, I believe younger is better. The other thing that I think doesn’t happen enough, and again, this is just my personal opinion, but is that companies have an opportunity to do a better job succession planning, and identifying talent that they believe have the skills and capabilities to be able to, to progress up through the organization. And that, you know, I think that needs to be done earlier than later. And whether it’s in customer success, or whether it’s in sales or any position, quite frankly, within an organization, companies need to really begin to look at their early stage talent and begin to identify individuals that they feel have the right foundation, that to build on, so that they’re not going out and having to hire externally, that they’re that they’re building their talent internally, and that they can have a pool of individuals that they can you know, that they can promote up through the organization. It’s that’s just going to it’s going to decrease turnover. It’s going to increase loyalty. And I think there’s a lot of different reasons why organizations need to, to do that. And then spend money and invest in them.

Anne Bibb 49:53
Invest in your people. Invest in your people.

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 49:59
You’re spending A lot of money, filling empty buckets and going to replace them. Why don’t you just, you know, don’t? Wouldn’t it be better use of your dollars to just invest in the people? That you have? I don’t know, seems seems logical to me, but

Anne Bibb 50:17
you know, you have your own business now. So

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 50:23
I have control that.

Anne Bibb 50:25
There you go, there you go. So, Heidi, now, today, I’m gonna get a different answer. When I asked this question, why would people reach out to you? And how would they reach out to you? Yeah, actually,

Heidi Solomon-Orlick 50:40
the how it’s the same. The, you know, I’m really accessible on LinkedIn. I encourage people to reach out. And although getting more productive of my time, I do carve out some time on my calendar for for coffee chats, and I’m super passionate about mentoring and, and helping other people progress in their their career. So hopefully, that won’t get taken out of context. And, and that it’s not still incredibly important to me to do to do that. So LinkedIn is, is the best way. If the if someone’s listening, and they’re like, Oh, girls who sell you know, if you’re a, you know, high school age woman or college aged woman, and you want to learn more about GirlzWhoSell in our cohorts and training program and, and our scholarship programs, you can go to www dot girls who sell.com That’s girls with a Z ¬†who sell.com. And then if, you know, we’re always looking for corporate sponsors, our programs are 100% free to our students. And so we, you know, rely on corporate sponsors and partners and our colleges and universities and high schools to enable us to to build the next generation of future sales leaders. So reach out. It sounds interesting, and you want to call me if you want to learn if you want to learn more about how to get involved.

Anne Bibb 52:26
Well, Heidi, thank you for coming back. And coming. Yeah, thanks for having me. And for everybody else. Thanks for joining us, and we will see you again next time. As we wrap up the episode we would like to take this time to thank you for joining us this week on unexpected journey. Our guest information will be linked in the episode description along with a link to our hosts website, and bibb.com and our sponsors websites, remote evolution.com, ethos, support.com, and your cohort.co. Please don’t forget to like, subscribe and share on your favorite podcast app and on our YouTube channel so that you never miss an episode and we can continue to bring them to you. Let us know your thoughts on what we discussed in the comment section. And once again, thanks for joining us. We hope to see you again next time on Unexpected Journey


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